Finding The Right Audience

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“Don’t make money your goal. Instead, pursue the things you love doing, and then do them so well that people can’t take their eyes off you.” – Maya Angelou

I’ve talked with a lot of authors about their marketing strategy, I’ve promoted many who are trying to sell their books, I’ve written reviews of books I’ve read, I’ve connected with a lot of incredible people on WordPress. But if you ask me my marketing strategy, I think my best description would be “organic.” That is to say, I’m doing my best work and hoping that others will find it.

This is probably something you all know – but mostly I have podcast conversations because they are what I need to hear. They just happen to be recorded in the case they are useful to others. 🙂 The podcast conversation I had with Nancy Martira of Clew Strategy for this week’s The Life of Try episode about how to create a brand strategy for humans (in this age of machines) is one of the most helpful and informative.

So I loved talking with Nancy who is an incredibly smart and practical brand strategist. She helped me see some really key points:

  • Reputation vs brand: Reputation is how people perceive us and brand is what you say you are. There is risk when they are at odds. Think of a snarky blogger who tries to market an uplifting book. I only give that example because I don’t know any snarky bloggers but you can see why one might not believe that snark and uplifting go together.
  • We don’t have to be on all the platforms. This is one I wrestle with on a regular basis. It feels like there are too many platforms and I am always behind. Nancy’s advice is to be much more thoughtful about trying to reach for audiences that are already looking for what we have to give. (Big thanks to the WP community – I’m so grateful I’ve found you).

    My dear friend, Victoria Atkinson of the Victoria Ponders blog does this so well. She regularly speaks to audiences about writing for wellness, goes to lit fests, and serves on panels, and in doing so shows she knows how to find readers… and writers that need her beautiful guidance and her incredible books, Surviving Sue, a memoir, and Slivers, the companion novel.
  • Of course, finding the right audience means knowing what our value proposition is — or in Nancy’s great story about George Saunders, our “iconic space” (reference link below). Whether it is finding a job, marketing a book or a podcast, or anything else, knowing what it is that only we can create is essential. Nancy has some great actionable ways to do this.
  • How can we appeal to humans when technology like SEO, algorithms, and AI are cluttering the process? This one often makes my head hurt. Nancy offers some great suggestions for how and when to use technology in a way that doesn’t lessen the human appeal of what we have to offer.

Nancy helps expert-led businesses, authors, job seekers, and knowledge-based professionals find what makes them impossible to ignore. This conversation is especially helpful for writers, creators, entrepreneurs, and professionals who feel uncomfortable with self-promotion just like I do. Nancy’s approach to brand strategy is deeply human, clear, and encouraging — perfect for anyone trying to become more visible while staying true to themselves.

Nancy has a lot of incredible experience and actionable wisdom so the full episode is 46 minutes. Here’s a short clip that contains some great advice for authors:

If you’ve ever wondered how to market a book, promote your business, refresh your LinkedIn profile, stand out in a crowded job market, or build a personal brand that feels authentic, this episode will help you think more clearly about reputation, positioning, storytelling, and the courage to be seen.

Here are some ways you can listen and watch this full episode:

Links for this episode:

Nancy Martira at Clew Strategy: ⁠https://www.clewstrategy.com/⁠ and her Career Positioning Workshop.

Hyperfixed Podcast with Alex Goldman, September 2025. “Alex and the Impossible Ask” 

George Saunders is a best-selling author and a professor of English at Syracuse University. Nancy quotes from his book A Swim in a Pond in the Rain in our conversation. The book is available on Bookshop.org and the audiobook is available on Libro.fm. 

Nancy tells a charming origin story about her company name. This blog post goes more in-depth into what “Clew” means to her. 

 Other episodes you might enjoy

⁠Identity Before Strategy: How to Break Through Invisible Ceilings with Kevin Yoder⁠

⁠The Power of Looking At Your Life Through a New Lens⁠

⁠How to Tell Relatable Stories⁠

(featured photo from Pexels)

If my work has encouraged, inspired, or helped you try something new, consider supporting it with a small “cup of coffee” donation. Your support helps me keep creating conversations, stories, and resources that cheer people on as they do brave, meaningful work.

You can find me on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/wynneleon/ and Instagram wynneleon

36 thoughts on “Finding The Right Audience”

  3. A fascinating conversation, Wynne. Self marketing is a tricky balance, especially when it doesn’t come naturally or feel comfortable to someone.

    It’s nice there are many different tools and channels now within reach – and different ways to use each tool, depending on your goal and the audience most likely to be reached on each channel.

    I agree there is so much noise and the best way to find your niche is to be yourself. Interesting to hear the discussion on brand vs reputation. It’s the reason I can’t bring myself to start Harry Potter with T because of Rowling’s views on trans people.

    At the end of the day, be your authentic self – and you’ll find your audience – and this rings so true and warmly in your posts and podcasts!

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    1. I love that you mentioned Harry Potter – exactly! And thank you for the comment about authenticity, Ab. With so many different things to try, at least we can pick the ones that mean we don’t have to change ourselves!! Thanks for tuning in, my friend!

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  4. Your approach of just doing things organically hits with me. That’s become my approach of choice after having tried paying for advertising on Facebook and another I can’t remember at this moment. My paid attempts at promoting my books didn’t result in a bump in book sales or people following my blog, in fact there wasn’t any difference so I stopped trying to push it.

    I realized that I needn’t worry about trying to reach more and more people, that the ones who needed to read what I was saying would come and I had to trust that process. Since then I just create material that speaks to me, and if it touches others then I’m happy.

    Authenticity means a lot to me and some of the best moments I have is connecting with people in the comments either on my blog or theirs.

    Thanks for bringing this topic out to meet us!

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    1. Ah, love hearing your thoughts on this, Tamara. Your approach of trusting the process is so good! It’s so nice to have such a great community and then we can talk about what works — and what doesn’t! Thanks for tuning in!

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  5. I love one of your concluding comments in the podcast, Wynne –“meaty stuff”. Oh my goodness, yes! What a delight to listen and learn from Nancy. I think the observations about corporations shifting responsibility to individuals (whether in regard to tipping or book promotion/pr work) is spot on. Burdensome and precarious. I also appreciated Nancy’s thoughts about “going where you’re wanted” rather than the big ‘spray and pray’. Thank you for the generous shout outs, too. Good to hear encouraging words throughout. xo! 💝

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    1. I thought the take on corporations shifting responsibility was so interesting too! I love all that you do to meet the right audiences, dear Vicki! You are such a great writer — and also so good at meeting people where needed. My hats off to you, my dear friend!

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  7. There is no doubt that you and Nancy Martira see the world as it is and can adapt to it. One hopes that others who can find a way to make a living in our world are also able to adjust and fit into the new one or ones ahead.

    According to author, historian, and public intellectual, Yuval Harari, the changing world of AI will include the need to adapt and change professions several times in a lifetime. He believes that AI and the employment opportunities available will leave many people in a state of painful distress, unable to make themselves over to fit into the employment needs of the moment.

    They will try to retrain themselves out of necessity, of course, but live with the uncertainty that the profession they retrained for might already be in decline by the end of the effortful time it took to prepare themselves anew.

    Harari is uncertain when this will occur and recognizes that some new jobs are likely to appear because of AI. Let us hope they do not leave the average worker behind.

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    1. Such a good point from Harari, Dr. Stein. The uncertainty and displacement is uncomfortable and unsettling. What I loved from Nancy is her focus on a human-strategy because ultimately that’s the audience, even if we need to navigate the machines in between.

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      1. I agree with its virtues, Wynne. My concern is that at least the bottom half of those seeking satisfying and lasting employment may well be out of luck, according to Harari. And, if so, it will impact almost all others who seek a satisfying and self sustaining existence.

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  8. Vicki is so active on all platforms and does so much in person stuff too, I don’t know how she does it but I’m in awe! And totally agree that finding the right audience is really important. You can have tons of followers but it means nothing if they’re not interested in your content.

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  9. I love Nancy. While I’m listening, I’m “Gemini-ing” my county-wide library system asking if they host seminars or book readings or “Meet the Author” type events in non-fiction or memoir. I’m thinking about going where I’m wanted (and my ms isn’t even done yet, haha.) She has such wise words about corporations and how they have shifted the burden to the author to market themselves. I may have to hire the professional fundraiser she mentions, as the “tough ask” is incredibly hard for me. But that’s where we are. I hope there is an intersection of passion and luck. ☺️ I really, really enjoyed this episode, Wynne.

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    1. Intersection of passion and luck – I love that, Melanie! And I’m not surprised that you are jumping right on to figuring out where the author events are because you are so good at leaning in and connecting. I’m really looking forward to reading the book she mentions from the fundraiser. Maybe that’s the next thread I need to follow to get someone like that to come on the podcast! Thanks for tuning in and the great comment, my friend!

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  10. such a great discussion! for years i worked in pr/promotion for an ad agency that had film, theater, and parade clients. it was a lot of work but i had no issues making a plan for a campaign and executing it and getting results. after i left the business to become a teacher, i found my favorite job and did some writing/blogging as a creative outlet. i cannot even imagine doing pr/promotion for myself if i was ever to write a book! nancy put things in perspective and offered some solid ideas for how to get over the barriers –

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    1. I knew you worked in pr, Beth but I didn’t know it was for film, theater and parade clients. That is so awesome! You make a great distinction between doing it for others and doing it for ourselves. It’s so tough! Thanks for listening and the great feedback!

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  13. They may be messages that you need to hear Wynne … but you’re not the only one. I find that creatives are often like the cobbler’s kids. We know how to help others but we’re not always certain about helping ourselves! At least it’s that way for me!!!😎

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  16. Amen to all this. In my opinion, it’s much better to do a little bit well (not just in marketing but in all areas of life) than to spread ourselves too thin and do a half-assed job on everything.

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  17. I found the conversation very useful for someone who is already in the market. What I am missing is a strategy for someone starting from scratch (like no experience at all, someone completely new in that job or product they want to sell). Clients would want to see a record of success stories, where your reputation has been built on, but if you are just starting a new business, what to do?

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